Southern Brooklyn

Sheepshead Bay Mosque Wins First Court Battle, Bay People Push Forward

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Sheepshead Bay Mosque
The site of the proposed mosque. Local Muslims painted over where a vandal had previously spray painted "He is dead" after Osama bin Laden's death.

A Kings County Supreme Court judge refused yesterday to issue an injunction against the proposed mosque at 2812 Voorhies Avenue that would have required them to halt construction. But Bay People, the opponents of the mosque, are saying the “fight is far from over.”

The morning hearing was for a preliminary injunction to stop contractors from continuing work on the mosque until neighbors’ zoning challenges have been properly reviewed. The motion was filed in April by lawyers from the main opposition group, Bay People, after they got tired of what they believe to be administrative stonewalling.

According to members of the group, structural drawings have not been made available, and Department of Buildings office workers have told them the copy machine was broken – for several months now. Councilman Lew Fidler wrote a letter to the DOB earlier this year on Bay People’s behalf, requesting that the DOB follow the letter of the law and provide access to the publicly available materials.

Bay People has issued a challenge to the entire permit, pleading with the agency to revoke approval of the construction. They say the property owner has manipulated the floor plan, shrinking the number of people the building will hold and thereby eliminating the requirement for parking.

The group argued before the judge yesterday that an injunction was needed until they exhaust all administrative remedies so that “construction cannot take place and cause irreparable harm to the neighboring properties and the community at large, while it is being challenged.” The judge, Hon. Mark Partnow, apparently found the argument without merit.

Bay People members, though, aren’t flinching.

The mosque’s attorney, Lamis Deek, presented “lies by [the proposed site’s landlord] Allowey Ahmed and the mosque builders,” Bay People said in a press release last night. “[Judge] Portnow denied a preliminary injunction without giving a reason for his decision. He ruled from the bench within minutes, which appears that his ruling was pre-determined. Lamis Deek, the defense attorney, had only one argument, the ‘race card.'”

Opponents are regrouping, and filing an appeal immediately, according to their press release. But that’s not all – they’re also taking action against the Department of Buildings, for “failing to adequately consider our zoning challenge via unreasonable delays.”

The situation is eerily similar to that predicted several months ago by Fidler, when he urged the DOB to “evaluate the legalities of [the project] fairly, openly and consistently,” noting that “whatever decisions the agency makes will likely be challenged in Court by the ‘unhappy’ side.”

Organizers behind the mosque, however, are portraying the judge’s ruling as a victory against bigotry and selective enforcement.

“It was a win for justice,” said Ibrahim Anse, a member of the committee overseeing the construction. “Freedom and peace. God bless the USA.”

The Brooklyn chapter of the Muslim American Society – the group backing the Voorhies Avenue project – issued the following press release:

The Sheepshead Bay mosque has been a hot topic in the local community of Sheepshead Bay, Brooklyn, NY area for about 18 months since some of the neighbors opposed the project as a place of worship and center for the growing Muslim Community on the area.

Today, May 10th 2011, justice and equality prevailed by the Supreme Court of Kings County New York, where it denied all the claims against the proposed mosque that has been under construction, approved and permitted by the Department of Buildings of City of New York last November.

We, as members of the Muslim American Society (MAS), appreciate the court’s decision and are very thankful to our legal team under the supervision of Ms. Lamis J. Deek for the great efforts they spent at the case.

We also thank all the interfaith groups who stood in solidarity with this case to support justice and freedom. Many thanks to the officials who understood our right to build the mosque / community center that will benefit the community as a whole.

Finally, we are extending our hands to work with everyone for the betterment of our community and to share the neighborhood together; also, we are hoping that our relationship will improve and we will try to understand each other for a better living in equality and sprit of diversity as this nation was established.

Thank you and God bless you all.

Bay People issued the following press release:

Dear Bay People supporters, residents and friends,
This morning in Kings County Supreme Court, Judge Mark Portnow denied our request for a preliminary injunction in the face of plaintiffs’ affidavits, expert reports and countless violations, illegal excavation, and lies by Allowey Ahmed and the mosque builders. Portnow denied a preliminary injunction without giving a reason for his decision. He ruled from the bench within minutes, which appears that his ruling was pre-determined. Deek, the defense attorney, had only one argument, the “race card” and called Bay People and Sheepshead Bay residents racists and terrorists and added that there are hundreds and hundreds Muslim families living in Sheepshead Bay and that they will all walk to the mosque and not drive.
Our next steps would be to appeal this decision immediately. Moreover we are commencing an action against the New York City Department of Buildings for failing to adequately consider our zoning challenge via unreasonable delays and erroneously granting a building permit in the face of numerous violations on lies on the application.
This fight is far from over and we as homeowners and residents of this community will employ every possible avenue to ensure that this peaceful and quiet residential street remains just that-RESIDENTIAL. We have NOT, repeat, have NOT exhausted our administrative remedies in the Department of Buildings, which are in month 9 (yes since October of 2010) of looking out our zoning challenge.
Please note that building permits may be taken away at any time and with this request for an injunction we were merely attempting to halt construction until the DOB renders a final decision on our zoning challenge. We will of course, proceed in our case against the DOB as soon as possible.
Thank you all for your support!
Sincerely,
Bay People Inc.

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358 COMMENTS

  1. I doubt very much that the judges decision was pre determined. The Bay People are a group of extremely closed minded, loud mouthed haters and anything that has been written about them proves it. I received something in the mail from them last week. It stunk of hatred. No matter what, Bay People, that mosque will be built. Get over it. The way you own your property, the landlord of the mosque owns his. Nobody tells you what to do wth your property, you have no say in what he does with his. America = freedom – of speech, religion etc. Get used to it.

  2. I suggest these people give up their fight. As a resident of Sheepshead Bay, and a conservative, I urge them to not embarrass the neighborhood. I know you can use the beaureaucracy and complexities of law to hinder, delay, maybe even prevent the mosque. As I’m against such tactics when, for example, Walmart wants to build, so I am against the tactics here.

    Any reasonable person would conclude that the real motivations are anti-Muslim. In this society, we cannot assume such a mosque will be used for terrorism even before it is built.

    However, I do hope that law enforcement and Homeland Security pays attention to the financing and membership, though. In times where terrorism is overwhelming Muslim-based, protests of ‘racial profiling’ are incredibly silly and dangerous.

  3. I’m going to protest the new construction at the church on voorhies and ocean. its really affecting my quality of life, especially those flea markets.

  4. They are now being funded by Pamela Geller and her group of Islamophobes. The object is to keep the construction project in litigation long enough to bankrupt the mosque.

    The ruling was made because Bay People could not prove their case. They will lose on appeal. They can appeal again, and probably lose. They can institute a new suit, but they shall need different grounds. Lawyers can be very creative.

  5. They are not laughing at me (not for this cause anyway) you and a bunch of others here on Bites.

  6. The BBC article did not allow for comments. I wish it did, I wanted to explain to the world that there are many people in Sheepshead Bay who do not share the viewpoint of the Bay People.

  7. i hope you understand that Muslims arn’t the only “Terrorists” there are a LOT of other people who are.

    gonna leave it at that, since nothing good can come out of my mouth in regards to that topic. all i am gonna say is, There oil was Taken. >:)

  8. Mocking is racist.

    You are Amererican White middle class self-hater, I suppose?

    Waiting for Sharia to bring some sense of purpose to your life, is it?

  9. YOUR narrow-mindedness, how so very true.

    Paris-2005 and Malmo-2010, Molly Norris-2011 taught nothing?

    Wait for Sh-Bay-2012.

  10. I, for instance, live less than one block from 2812 Voorhies. Own a house (on mortgage, of course).

  11. I fail to see why you are unable to say that Islamic radicals are committing most if not all of the most violent terrorist acts. That’s narrow-mindedness? I suggest that political correctness run amok is narrow-minded, and extremely dangerous.

    And to say that we shouldn’t devote a little extra resources to investigate Muslim gatherings is just some sort of foolhardy illogic. Due to some weird sense of “equal”, we must search a 80 year old African-American grandmother for every 25 year old Muslim. But that’s narrow-minded? Okay.

  12. I hate to repeat myself, but it’s especially embarrassing to people who live in S. Bay, and to people of conservative thought who sometimes get associated with such racist nonsense. I don’t live in that immediate area, but I for one would love to be next to any legitimate place of worship. Though not religious myself, I think mostly good citizens go to houses of worship. Plus, with more people walking around the streets, less chance of my building/house getting ripped off.

  13. Guys, I also hate to repeat myself. My still can not get an answer from my leftists friends.

    please visit the Government Site:

    http://foreignaffairs.house.go

    “The conference for which he serves as director, PEACE, 58 is run by the Muslim

    American
    Society (MAS), an organization with strong ties to the Muslim
    Brotherhood.MAS was founded as the United States chapter of the Muslim
    Brotherhood, the international Islamist, anti-Western organization whose
    goal is the “introduction of the Islamic Shari’ah as the basis of
    controlling the affairs of state and society.”

    Are you familiar
    with these documents? Is these true or the lie of the another racist?
    Me personally, I have nothing against Muslims. I personally hired the
    Muslim person to work for me… I have a problem with these kind of
    documents. Are you sure these all the lie and the racist’s speech? Or
    maybe these are the real documents?

    CAN SOMEBODY READ IT AND ARGUE WITH ME AFTER THAT, SO I WILL STOP TO AFRAID THE MUSLIM AMERICAN SOCIETY AND WELCOME THE NEW NEIGHBORS/ CAN SOMEBODY TELL ME ITEM BY ITEM IS THIS USA CONGRESS TESTIMONY MAKE SENSE OR NOT? ITEM BY ITEM, NOT JUST TELL ME THAT I AM A RACIST AND HATE MUSLIMS. THIS IS NOT TRUE. CHICAGO TRIBUNE, INVESTIGATIVE PROJECTS, ADL MANY OTHER REPUTABLE MEDIA… ARE THEY ALL LIARS AND PROVIDE PEOPLE WITH THE WRONG INFO?

    P.S.
    I perfectly understand, when the left oriented people can not provide
    the logical explanation, they call their opponent “The racist”. But I
    hope you will provide the proof that MAS is a great American
    organizations without any ties to the Muslim brotherhood?

    So far my understanding is YES. And I simply do not believe our government today today and the last 10 years…. 14 trillion debt to China and Saudi Arabia and increasing of the debt ceiling telling us that they simply do not care about all of us… Only about the re-election and to stay close to the feeder….

  14. Because that is not the point of this article. When we say here, within the context of discussing the right of this congregation to build a mosque “All terrorists are Muslims”, then we don’t have to go too far to come to saying “All Muslims are terrorists”. Which is what some of the critics of this project are implying.

  15. Please move then. I’d like to live in a neighborhood free from bigots and other sorts of poisonous people consumed with hate.

    But in a democracy you can’t legislate attitudes. So unfortunately, we are stuck with your unfortunate nonconstructive energy.

  16. When you start asking for the apartment houses that sits behind the mosque construction site to be torn down, and take that matter into court I’ll answer you qiestion.

  17. kind of strange how the Muslims had black spray paint ready to paint over the black spray painted words. I would have choice white the same color as the board. hope it’s not like an Alaska incident where a Muslim destroyed his store and blamed Non-Muslims just to get what he wanted the community helped him out but then he got caught. and according to some America = ‘terrorism’

  18. Please watch the video. Most powerful leader of MAS (the developer of the Sheepshead Bay Mosque) is supporting HAMAS, the terrorist organization based on the GOV anti-terrorism center http://www.nctc.gov/site/groups/hamas.html and Wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamas. Me personally, I do not want to see the organization with such leader near my house… Do you? or you want to tell me that this vider is created in the special lab of the evils – republicans?

    When I asked llevp, the blogger and Mosque supporter if his supports HAMAS , his answer were:” Isn’t Hamas an elected government of the Gaza Strip?
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H
    Thus I support a democratically elected Hamas..”

    When I asked Lisanna the same question, her answer were:”That’s NOT a relevant question…” Why? I can tell everybody that I do not support the HAMAS, their goal is to kill the Jews …Why this is not a relevant question for Lisanna, specially if the MAS leader (based on the video) supports HAMAS?

    Guys, wake up. What is going on? We are loosing the country. 55% of the people do not pay income taxes, we support the “peaceful” Jihad … , we China and Saudi Arabia can thru us under the bus with out 14 trillion dollars debt, we spend money what we do not have, we became the nation of the total welfare, we forgot how to work and how to produce, we want to take all the money from the “rich” taxpayers and re-distribute… Ok . All the private sector taxpayers will go out of country, What’s next….?

    Levp, Lisanne,wake up please!!!!

  19. Not necessary, levp. That depends on many factors, including the political correctness, connections of BIG GUYS ( George Bush for example ) with Saudi Arabia and many other factors. Guys from FBI are professional and know the job, but, do not forget, there are many politicians above them, who dictate … Do not forget, Eric Holder is investigated the CIA for some reasons, even if these “reasons” helped us to get OBL. if I am wrong, please correct me. The FBi can not perform how they want and what’s right. Pressure from the politicians and their agenda… So far, the leader of MAS is supporting HAMAS (you probably did see the video) and HAMAS is a terrorist organization. Your thoughts? Of course, except calling me “the racist”

  20. what a jackass. We paid for that fucking oil. And they were happy to take the money. So fucking stupid its amazing. The average level of education on this board can’t exceed 7th grade…

  21. Lisanne, why are you so combative?

    And levp how would you feel if you lived right alongside the site and this mosque were being built between you and your neighbor?
    Would you be as happy?

    The apartment building was not constructed between two small houses and is on the block behind Voorhies.

    The issue is that the mosque is being built between two homes for no good reason at all.

    You have the right to feel as you do and so do I.

    I cannot think of another church or synagogue that has been built in such a manner as this mosque.

    The people behind this are thoughtless – period.

  22. I have already provided my opinion on the link that you posted. That opinion has not changed.

    You have a right to be very afraid of whatever and whoever you want. I can not argue with that. I only know that I am not afraid.

    You also have a right to vote for whatever presidential candidate you want, provided that you are U.S. citizen and properly registered to vote.

    Bottom line: there is no point to argue further.

  23. I do live less that 1 block away from 2812 Voorhies Avenue.

    As an Atheist, I do not want to see any churches, mosques or synagogues. But we live in the United States of America, and so I respect equal rights of others to worship whatever they want. End of story.

  24. We’re not going any further here. By law they hve the right to build a mosque. That is the same law that allows the construction of a church or a temple. And any other religious structure. One either supports the rights of all religions equally, or they have to agree that none have special rights. Since your arguments are specific to your view of Islamic practice it is obvious that you are exercising a discriminatory view. Knowing that this view is flawed, I shall not engage in countering the specifics. Nothing is gained by doing so.

  25. Lisanne, you do not hear me or you do not want to hear me or… you are simply afraid to answer even yourself… Probably all your life you did follow your emotions only about the “progressive” ideas how to make everybody equal (actually – equal – poor, but that can realize only the people, who lived in the former Soviet Union). You probably did not follow simple logic and math. And finally started to understand what is going on…

    Lisanne, you are a nice person with a big heart, open for everybody. But…. your emotions are prevailed too much. Start to analyze …. Probably you did, because you do not want even answer my question. You are afraid to tell the truth yourself.

    Logistic is simply:

    1. Watch the video : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bBIcfigtbEU

    2. The leader of MAS ( developer of the Sheepshead Bay Mosque ) , based on this video, supports HAMAS

    3. People do not want this organization ( not Muslim, just Muslim American Society ) because their leader is supporting HAMAS

    4. HAMAS is a terrorist organization. Their goal – to kill Jews and destroy Israel.

    5. Lisanne, about the Israel. You have to understand one thing – Israel does not need the war. HAMAS and Muslim Brotherhood – YES. Lisanne,
    not one Jewish mother wants her child to risk their life!!! Not one!!!

    6. Reputable open media sources write about connections between MAS and Muslim Brotherhood… Many sources, and nobody, NOBODY, can tell that they are lying!!!

    7. Please find something wrong with my logic and with my question if you support HAMAS

    Thank you, Lisanne.

  26. Sharia – really simple. Levp, you are the great with computers and google search. D Please do the following:

    1. See what is going on in Europe, specially France

    2. Just use your imagination and try to understand what is going to be there in 20 years

    3. Search about the Muslim immigration into United States. President Obama simply opened the door for them (based on my personal vision and understanding)

    4. Now answer the question: how many kids in average Muslim family?

    5. How many kids in average non-Muslim family?

    6. Do your math

    7. Organizations like MAS openly brain wash the regular nice Muslim people in the new opened Mosques (based on open sources and personal observations of many people around ). Brain wash – this is a very strong instrument.

    8. Now, use your imagination again. When our country is going to be half Muslim, what kind of law are they going to use and promote any possible way?

    Levp, I am not argue that the sharia law good or bad. Maybe even better than our laws, who knows…But in this case America, the best country in the world, is not going to be AMERICA. Just the addition to Saudi Arabia or, even, … afraid to think about it. If the HAMAS and Brotherhood ideologies will prevail, the first target – Jewish People…

    Simply look at. That will make you laugh http://www.house.gov/apps/list/press/ny09_weiner/022604Saudi.html

  27. This is good news, and a victory for reason and tolerance. The folks protesting this are seriously sick, and should get out of NYC.

  28. 1. It’s interesting that you mentioned France, traditionally secular country:
    http://articles.cnn.com/2011-04-11/world/france.burqa.ban_1_france-s-islamic-burqas-french-muslim?_s=PM:WORLD

    Additionally, there are not that many Muslims in France specifically or Europe in general:
    “The total number of Muslims in the European Union in 2007 was about 16 million (3.2%)”.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_in_Europe
    So 96.8% >>>>>>>>>>> 3.2% in so many overwhelming ways…

    2. I imagine it will be about the same. But let’s imagine that Muslim population in Europe will DOUBLE! ZOMG!!11! That will mean they will comprise a “whopping” 6.4% of total population! OMG again!! They are taking over… Wait, 6.4% is still only 6.4% and 93.6% >>>>>>>>> 6.4%… Oh, never mind then.

    3. Here is the “Presidential Memorandum–Refugee Admissions” that all right-wing websites are panicking about:
    http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2010/10/08/presidential-memorandum-refugee-admissions

    So how many of those 80000 refugees are Muslims?
    “It was estimated in 2002 that Christians form 40% of Africa’s population, with Muslims forming 45%.”
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Africa
    “Asia is the world’s largest and most populous continent, with millions of different peoples following a wide variety of different religions. Asia was the birthplace of most of the world’s mainstream religions including Buddhism, Christianity, Confucianism, Hinduism, Islam, Jainism, Judaism, Sikhism, Taoism, Zoroastranism as well as many other beliefs.”
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Asia
    “The Middle East is very diverse when it comes to religions, many of which originated there. Islam in its many forms is by far the largest religion in the Middle East, but other faiths, such as Judaism and Christianity, are also well represented.”
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Middle_East#Religions

    Even if we go along with freerepublic.com and assume that ALL 80000 immigrants would be Muslim (which they won’t),
    80,000/310,500,000 (people in the U.S.) = 0.02% = 50 times less than one single percent!

    You know who is not subject to any quotas?
    “b. Persons in the former Soviet Union” – that’s me and you – unlimited!

    4, 5 and 6. You tell me, preferably with links to sources.

    7. That’s where FBI informants come in. They had a big presence so far (http://www.google.com/search?&q=fbi+muslim+sting ), and I see no reason for this to change.

    8. I have no imagination. I know, it’s sad. But it is what it is.

    Lastly, do you really want to visit Saudi Arabia? Or, do you know ANY Jews that would like to spend a “nice” vacation there? THAT will surely make me laugh.
    If you do know someone like that, Soviet Jews perfected the art of changing names to non-Jewish-sounding ones…

  29. I went through all posts here and by the time I was done I almost vomited. Soo much love for Islam. I’m keen to believe now that even self proclaimed atheists here have converted to Islam. Who can blame them? soon they will find them selfs living in Muslim ghettos among the brothers. So better start early (with the conversion) before they knock on your door at night and cut off your head on youtube.

    You must be Muslim terror supporter right? Next time you post something here start with Allah akbar brothers, death to infidels. It would be more truthful that way instead of mentioning reason and tolerance. Watch video below, that’s your reason and tolerance, in your face.

    Folks protesting this construction simply protecting their way of life, it is their neighborhood and they have full right to do so. So.. I think it’s you and your kind that should get out of NYC, no.. get the fuck out of NYC.

    Have you dealt with “our” “local” muslims? Question for everyone. Have you? All you muslim lovers here… have you dealt with them .. personally, on the personal level? I bet no. Well I have. And I can tell you that they are pushy, ignorant, obnoxious human beings who refuse to become Americans and embrace American way of life.

    Let them build their fucking mosque there, let them. let’s see how it ends.

    Here is link for you all to see. While watching this.. some may say.. YAY ALLAH and Go Muslim brotherhood! and YAY Hamas.

    This is not a fabricated video.

  30. I agree with Rep. Weiner, but this link is about Saudi Arabia – not Sheepshead Bay or even Brooklyn.
    Thus not relevant to this conversation.

  31. I agree with Rep. Weiner, but this link is about Saudi Arabia – not Sheepshead Bay or even Brooklyn.
    Thus not relevant to this conversation.

  32. I dealt with Muslims (although in New Jersey), as part of Peace Action outreach work.
    We went along just fine. You don’t think that Muslims here are very different from the ones in NJ, are you?

  33. At the risk of inflaming things further – and, by the way, I have little opinion regarding the mosque – but the blanket statement here bothers me and needs to be pointed out.

    “And I can tell you that they are pushy, ignorant, obnoxious human beings who refuse to become Americans and embrace American way of life.”

    That is EXACTLY what the area’s non-Russians have been saying for two decades regarding Russians. It’s as true in that case as it is in this one.

    Further reading: http://bklyner.com/2010/09/american-marine-and-muslim-the-choice-is-yours/

  34. Also: are there any Atheists other than self-proclaimed ones?
    “I hereby proclaim you an Atheist. Go forth and…”

    And all Atheists do not have the same opinion on everything. Christopher Hitchens, for example, has a very similar opinion on Islam as you do. He is an ardent supporter of wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. I’m not.

  35. Is Lisanne Anderson is also funding the Mosque?

    People who live NEXT to the Mosque (unless, they will use it) have a problem with it, many people living farther away also are worried on the impact on traffic and noise.

    Where will people park 5X a day?

  36. I don’t have any opinion about Islamic belief. I do have a strong attachment to the principles that motivated the founders of this country. They believed that pluralism was the basis of a healthy society. They also believed that we should be ruled by fear or xenophobia. There have been few groups that have come here that were no met with some form of suspicion by some of those who came earlier. And yet, for most of our history we freely welcomed all who came.

    I am tired of hearing from people who are here because they or their ancestors were allowed to come despite the protestations of some narrow minded people. What was given to us is what our country offers to all who we welcome to our shore. The attitude of believing that some people have the right to live here freely while others do not is anti-American.

  37. Case in point: every president since Reagan, every year, re-authorized an exemption from immigration quotas for two groups of people:
    a. Persons in Cubab. Persons in the (former) Soviet Union

    Heck, that’s why *I* am here!

  38. Lisanne is local treasure. She knows more about everything than you know about anything.

    I propose we build her a mosque on Sheepshead. We can call it Sistine Chapel Of St Anderson.

  39. Oh sacred St Lisanne, mother of all fish with human teeth, bless us your humble flock of rejects and fuckups. Watch over us when we eat sushi and discuss cellphone contracts on Sheepshead Bay Rd also know as river Styx. Guide us straight to Chicken Masters during our drunken stupor all the way from Wheelers up the curvy paths and straight to box of Wing Zings. Under your protection I shall see no trash on the streets, hear no cars with techno, or be stabbed by Russians when I walk through the valley of Sheepshead.

    Blessed Be.

  40. And we know that there are people who object to such immigration. But there is nothing they could do about it, our system is set up so that we can provide a refuge to those who need it most. We certainly don’t use it perfectly, but when we do we provide protection against acts that would take away basic rights from those who we do allow to come. For all of the scare tactics that are used to turn people against those who are legally here our system prevails. I just wish that those who have benefited from this in the past would recognize that unless there is a compelling reason to restrict those rights it is our obligation as Americans to stand up against any attempt to repress other Americans. Even in the face of the consequences of hatred which is the unfortunate response of those who can only hate, even if they have been the recipient of the embrace of our country and all it offers.

  41. Here is the problem Young one. You get your information………From the Media which is Controlled by? you guessed it! our Gov’t.

    I have (and had Sadly) friends in the army. So before you start telling me your Commercial Garbage think first. Your not the only soul to get lied to by the media, so don’t feel bad 🙂

    We didn’t pay for shit, Ignorant Folk. you must still think 9-11 happened because of Jet fuel…………Dumbass.


  42. I cannot think of another church or synagogue that has been built in such a manner as this mosque. ”

    How can you write this about a building that is nothing more than a foundation at this time?

  43. Lisanne,

    As an Islam groupie you seem to be balbbing about the law and the right to build a religious structure. I will agree with you US Constitution grants everyone the right to practice any religion. The Constitution does not grant one group of people the right to violate zoning laws and to build illegal consturctions in a residential neighborhood. All you talk about is “Islamaphobe” and never mention the real violation. The backers of the mosque are violating zoning laws and yet you look the other way.

    Answer this – if another minority group (lets say Dominicans) tries to purchase a piece of land in residential neighborhood and try to open a steel mill factory there. The zoning only allows for residential buildings but they apply for a permit to build a GYM (parking garage with our MAS friends) and scream loud that local Gringos are discriminating against them. They are building their factory because they are allowed to earn a living in any way they want. They called it a GYM on the permit because ecause this is the only way their permit would get approved. When local residents complain about zoning violations and about noise they are labeled as El Gringos who are are Dominicanophobes.

    PS. Was it a sad day for you when OBL was killed?

  44. I’m not actually against that tactic. It’s legal for one thing. If they can just shut the fuck up with their hate speech and let their money talk behind closed doors then this whole situation wouldn’t be so heated.

  45. In my case, its anti-organized religion. I feel that Organized religion has too much power in our society. I’d rather new mosques and churches and synagogues not be built at all.

    However, the law is the law, and people have a right to build. So long as its the LAW used to prevent them, I’m fine and happy with that.

    On the other hand, if the law protects them long enough to build, well, thats the law. I’m not happy about it, but thats life.

  46. As a AMERICAN, I defend the constitution. The constitution gives them the right to worship, and by extension, the right to build religious structures that facilitate that practice.

    That is all. Your need to cast aspersions says a lot of the lack of substance in your arguments.

  47. Ugh – why waste my time with this? Oh, right I like a good laugh.

    Upon said foundation will be a building unless it is going to be invisible.

    This and no other religious structure belongs in that spot on that block – that should appease atheists, agnostics and everyone else.

    It is being built between 2 family houses and will bring a lot of foot and car traffic (read: people) on a block that is not designed for it.

    As for “Islamophobes” or whatever, they have the absolute right to feel the way they do – I too will never forget 9/11 and the parties responsible for it. I am NOT saying all Muslims are evil – of course not – but people are skeptical and wary as this country must be.

    Another point to ponder – do you also think it is a mere coincidence that a Muslim group is trying to build a mosque in such close proximity to Ground Zero?

    A little sensitivity can go a long way.

  48. Oh come on – black spray paint is easily available. Hell, I carry spray paint in my car. It comes in handy when some douche hits your bumpers. That was a rediculous thing to pick on.

  49. Both steel mill factory and a gym are commercial developments thus will be denied in a residential zone, even if actual Russians will apply for a permit.

    P.S. For me it was a happy day. What about you?

  50. It keeps happening while we discuss this subject:
    You start fine in re: location(people nodding their heads in agreement), but then jump right back into the same trap as before in re: local Muslims caused 9/11 (people make a face and leave).

  51. Apparently a judge just invalidated the arguments you are making. And I am sure that the appellate courts would take the same position.

    At any rate, almost every party that discusses zoning laws also brings up references to Islamic terrorism. Which is not relevant to the right of individuals to worship freely and build institutions which are to be used for the same.

  52. no sir – you are wrong

    the lovely people who live on my block some of whom have been there for years and some are newcomers, did not perpetrate 9/11.

    what I mean is that some people cannot get past that and they are allowed the freedom to feel that – HOWEVER, MY sole objection to this building IS its close proximity to the private homes. It has nothing to do with religion.

    I am sorry if I miscommunicated.

  53. no sir – you are wrong

    the lovely people who live on my block some of whom have been there for years and some are newcomers, did not perpetrate 9/11.

    what I mean is that some people cannot get past that and they are allowed the freedom to feel that – HOWEVER, MY sole objection to this building IS its close proximity to the private homes. It has nothing to do with religion.

    I am sorry if I miscommunicated.

  54. no sir – you are wrong

    the lovely people who live on my block some of whom have been there for years and some are newcomers, did not perpetrate 9/11.

    what I mean is that some people cannot get past that and they are allowed the freedom to feel that – HOWEVER, MY sole objection to this building IS its close proximity to the private homes. It has nothing to do with religion.

    I am sorry if I miscommunicated.

  55. no sir – you are wrong

    the lovely people who live on my block some of whom have been there for years and some are newcomers, did not perpetrate 9/11.

    what I mean is that some people cannot get past that and they are allowed the freedom to feel that – HOWEVER, MY sole objection to this building IS its close proximity to the private homes. It has nothing to do with religion.

    I am sorry if I miscommunicated.

  56. Will Sistine Chapel Of St Anderson have parking?

    Will she pray 5X a day on a residential block?

  57. You are still stuck on the same note and keep ignoring the fact that there are zoning violations. All you do is point fingers at others and accuse them of being Islamaphobes while ignoring that the fact that backers of the mosque are violating zoning laws.

    You defend the constitution by ignoring direct violations.

  58. So when Russians or Dominicans apply for a permit and classify it as GYM but will build a STEEL MILL they will be denied. When Muslims apply for a permit and classify it as PARKING GARAGE to build a MOSQUE thats ok? No reverse discrimination? Hows it different when neighbors have concerns about noise issues from a commercial structure being built in a residential area. Both minority groups are trying to build an illegal construction, yet its ok for Muslims but not for others to violate NYC zoning laws.

    PS. What goes around comes around. He got what he deserved.

  59. And the judge is an idiot? Right?

    We are not discussing zoning violations because there are none. period.

    Now all of you can continue spewing. The mosque will be built, and I suggest you reconcile yourself to that fact.

    We are done here. You treat the constitution like it is a rag. You should be thankful that it exists.

  60. Read carefully: I said BOTH mill AND gym are illegal. However, religious institution (including mosque) is legal.

  61. Honestly, what I want, that to see how our politicians and all the democrats of all religion and nationality to condemn HAMAS and these people

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8B1FHeIP53Q Also, I would like to see how our leftists will call these people. Racists? No, racists are only Russians… I want MAS to condemn HAMAS and these people (see video). Why they do not do it? That may resolve a lot of problems and let Bay People to accept the new neighbors. Just please, do not call them racists and terrorists. They have a real point to be afraid of the MAS, and MAS should convince them that the people do not have to worry. Imam Rauf called that “building bridges”. Guys, I suggest – let’s seat down together and talk. Leftists, conservatives, jewish, christians, muslims, straight, gays… everybody. Sheepshead Bay Community. Talk, meet each other. But… I still want to begin this imaginary meeting with the question if the MAS and Muslims aroung him support HAMAS. What’s wrong with that, Looks to me, if the person supports HAMAS, he support the terror.

    Guys, your thoughts?

    Dear our MAS leaders and Muslim neighbors. I am sure you follow this forum. If anybody against HAMAS, please right about it. so You can prove to your Russian neighbors that nothing to worry about. Please do. let’s build bridges

  62. Latest example of “homegrown”
    radicalization

    “According to investigators, Fehrani
    told an undercover FBI informant: “We will blow up a synagogue in
    Manhattan and take out the entire building.” The same day, Mamdouh
    allegedly said “I hate Jews,” and Fehrani reportedly replied: “I
    want to kill them.” They also reportedly discussed growing beards and pais
    to disguise themselves as Hasidic Jews. They did not specify which synagogue
    they allegedly intended to bomb”.

    NYPD busts new terror plot against a synagogue. May, 2011
    Not too much is known yet about this story, except that the bust
    appears to come from city and state officials, and not the feds.  Two
    Americans of North African descent have been arrested, apparently on
    charges that they plotted a terrorist attack on at least one New York City synagogue:
    Two Americans have been arrested by New York City police
    for allegedly plotting to attack a synagogue in the New York area, Fox
    News has learned.
    One source described the case as the latest example of “homegrown”
    radicalization. The two men were identified as Mohammad Mamdouh, of
    Moroccan descent, and Ahmed Serhani, of Algerian descent.
    Serhani allegedly made a general statement about wanting to attack a
    synagogue –- though no specific synagogue was mentioned, according to
    initial information obtained by Fox News. With a history of drug
    dealing, Serhani was hoping to make enough money to purchase weapons and
    possibly explosives for the attack, one source said.

    This is the curious part:

    Serhani and Mamdouh are now being charged under a New
    York State terrorism law. Federal authorities usually prosecute
    terrorism-related offenses, but they declined to do so in this case.

    Andy McCarthy also found this odd, but not necessarily unprecedented:

    Oddly, it is said that the feds were not interested in
    the case, which was apparently pursued by the Manhattan district
    attorney’s office after the FBI declined to get involved. I say this is
    odd because the FBI and the NYPD work together in the Joint Terrorism
    Task Force, and most cases are taken federal. But the NYPD also has an
    intel/anti-terrorism capacity that is very robust, and the City acts
    independently of the feds from time-to-time, much to the dismay of the
    feds.

    Some people don’t know that the NYPD actually has its own
    intelligence agency that works globally (and in conjunction with federal
    authorities).  In fact. this appears to have caused some friction
    between and within those levels, as the New York Post reports today on an unrelated issue:

    A top NYPD terror expert has been booted from his post after refusing an order to take federal files on Osama bin Laden from
    the FBI’s New York headquarters, The Post has learned. … Last week,
    after bin Laden was killed, [Deputy Commissioner of Intelligence] Cohen
    told Nicholson to bring him the FBI’s latest dossier on him. But
    Nicholson refused his superior’s order, citing the federal agency’s
    policy of not allowing such documents to leave its office.

    Nicholson has extensive experience in naval intelligence, which will
    now be wasted as Nicholson gets shifted to normal police investigations.

    The Manhattan District Attorney will release more information on these charges later today.  We’ll keep an eye out for updates.
    http://hotair.com/archives/2011/05/12/nypd-busts-new-terror-plot-against-a-synagogue/

  63. Yes the judge is an idiot.  Is this the first time you heard of a idiot judge? Do you remember a judge in Washington DC who sued dry cleaners for millions when they lost his pants? He was an idiot and there are lots of other judges who are idiots as well.  I am sorry to say this but I now think you are an idiot and I lost all the respect I had for you.

    Building a commercial structure in residential area and by classifying it as something is a violation of the zoning laws.  If you, judge or anyone else doesnts see it than its obvious you have your own agenda for looking the other way.  This is not an issue of MAS trying to build a commercial structure in commercial area and bending the rules a little bit by classifying it as a parking garage.  They are trying to build something in an area that is only zoned for residentail projects.  You and others are using religion card as an excuse.  If any other minority group would try the same they would get denied.

    If the area is zoned for residential only and minority group wants to build a commercial structure there.  (*my examples are fictional)

    If Muslims try to build a commercial structure thats ok in residential area according to you.  What if Russians try to open a massage parlor in the same location? Would that be ok? What if Domicans open a steel mill in the same place? Still ok? What about Asians opening a laudromat? What about Jamaicans opening a night club?  All would be violating zoning laws since its a residential area.  Why would it be ok for Muslims and not for others.  If its ok to violate zoning laws than lets open up a 24/7 transgender sex shop in that location.  After all neighbors should not be complaining against people travelling from other neighborhoods to visit this store.  Zoning violation will be looked away so that their constitutional rights are protected.

    While my examples  show different scenarios they all display the fact that this is a residential area and should not have commercial buildings in it.

    PS. It is normal for people to hate others that done harm to them.  If you are a white woman who was gang raped by blacks you would be afraid of the blacks.  Actions done by small group would cause her to be afraid of the whole group.  If she would walk in a dark alley and would see a group of blocks they would be viewed as a threat.  Many of us see the same with Muslims.  Not all of them are bad but there are a lot o f radicals who  were celebrating on 9/11.  We see images of Muslims burning American flags, we see them issue attacks on Americans and their way of life.  Islam is not a religion of peace.  What religion support s gang rapes, death by stoning, arranged marriages, spousal abuse.  It is perfectly acceptable for a 70 year old man to buy a 10 year old bride, force her to have sex and if she refuses she can be gang raped or stoned to death.  I will probably have fatwa issued on me for writting this.  After all when someone disagrees with the views of Islam they must be killed. Islam wants to kill all the infidels or convert them to Islam.  There is no other way.  Americans are #1 hated infidels on their list.  Muslims cant even be in peace with each other.  Sunnis are killing Shia’s, Shia’s are killing Sunnis and together they are extermiating the Kurds.  Forgive me if I see things like that and see Islam as a threat.  I like my freedom and dont want to live under sharia law.  I dont want to see images of American flags being burned on American soil.

    PPS.  I am an atheist and dont support any religion.  Out of all religions in the world Islam is definitely the worst.  It is the only religion that wants to have totalitarian control over the world, rule it according to religious laws and will stop at nothing to accomplish that.

  64. “What religion support s gang rapes, death by stoning, arranged marriages, spousal abuse.  It is perfectly acceptable for a 70 year old man to buy a 10 year old bride, force her to have sex and if she refuses she can be gang raped or stoned to death.”

    This is my stop, time to get off the insane bus!

  65. “What religion support s gang rapes, death by stoning, arranged marriages, spousal abuse.  It is perfectly acceptable for a 70 year old man to buy a 10 year old bride, force her to have sex and if she refuses she can be gang raped or stoned to death.”

    This is my stop, time to get off the insane bus!

  66. They have a list. It includes everyone except themselves. 

    Wait, they might include themselves as well. This may well be self-hatred projected.

  67. OK so, besides the fact that Lisanne! really needs a good fuck, I, a former 2nd Circuit Ct of Appeals clerk, can say that just because a judge says something in NO WAY MAKES IT CORRECT. Check your facts. The zoning argument is a fair one. Forget all the islamic crap. Zoning violations are out of control in sheepshead bay. I lived in SB for 30 years and saw them violated more and more as the years progressed, i.e. 8 story condo built between 2 cottage size homes, restaurants in residential neighborhoods (rodents anyone?), and homes turned into makeshift synagogues. It is not fair to the people who bought homes on this block  assuming the zoning would be followed must now deal with the inevitable traffic, parking violations, that come with a house of worship.

    And seriously Lisanne, get out a bit, maybe get yourself some D batteries while your out…

  68.  Clerk. As in Troll. Ned sensor this shit head and my comment sooooon. Your MOTHER needs a good fuck. Iam going to hell if only to kick your sorry ass. You are the dirt on my shoes with your BS

  69. Please do not talk this may. I am absolutely seriously. Please do not abuse people. This is the same what the MAS is doing .
    You have a right to tell Lisanne , me or anybody else what you want (as per law, constitution…), but this is still not right way to do. Definitely not with woman!
    Me personally – I do not want to see the MAS (not Muslim people – only MAS with their connections to Muslim Brotherhood), but I do not want to be close with you after this post. Shame. This is not the way to talk or to argue. Thank you

  70. Why just pick on Lisanne?  What about me?  I’m disappointed…

    Also, in regards to D batteries, we have no need for those (solar-powered).  So you take those and shove them up your @#$.

  71. Thank you, Lisanne. Please do not pay attention to these kind of posts. Many people just really upset what is going on and started to loose control… Nerves…
    Lisanne, just did not have a chance to comment on your photos (morning mug). Beautiful! 

  72. You are preaching upon deaf ears – they need to look and see what is happening in France and England.  They are losing control to an ever burgeoning Muslim population.  In fact the most popular baby name in England last year was – ready – Mohammed!
    Liberals will only see their mistake when they are walking around in burkas.

  73. The graffiti on the fence of the construction site instead of saying “He is dead” should say “Coming near you: Taliban supporting imams!”
    I would love to be supportive of Islam, had not too many imams had converted the places of worship into the place of WAR!
    Read below:

    MIAMI – Three South Florida men have been charged with providing
    about $45,000 in financial support to the Pakistani Taliban, which the
    State Department has designated as a terrorist organization.

    The U.S. Attorney’s office in Miami announced
    Saturday the arrests of Hafiz Muhammed Sher Ali Khan and sons Irfan Khan
    and Izhar Khan. Hafiz Khan is the imam at Miami Mosque, also known as
    Flagler Mosque, and Izhar Khan is the imam at Jamaat Al-Mumineen Mosque
    in nearby Margate. Officials say the mosques are not suspected of
    wrongdoing.

    Authorities say they have recorded conversations in which Hafiz Khan supported violence perpetrated by the Pakistani Taliban.

    If convicted, the men face 15 years in prison for each of the four counts.

    Attempts to reach the men, their attorneys and their mosques were unsuccessful.

  74.  What, like there are no idiot judges?
    If there are idiot presidents, then what is the judge compared to a president?

  75. Also take a look at  today’s Bloomberg News – 2 Imams from South Florida mosques arrested for giving aid to the Taliban.  In case some have forgotten, the Taliban are intent on destroying the US.

  76. Lisanne would probably say that those two innocent “boys” were only exercising their rights under the First Amendment and got nabbed for terrorism. She would probably be there in the first row to protest and fight for the rights of those poor Muslim men who are persecuted unjustly for just throwing “innocent” jokes around. And if you point out that those two bought enough ammo to successfully rob a bank, she would probably say that they were only doing what Second Amendment allows them to do. And she would be there in the courtroom to cheer them if they invoke their Fifth Amendment rights.

    Founding Fathers must be turning in their graves every time Lisanne writes an opus that applies constitutional rights to people who do not consider themselves having constitutional obligations as well. Constitution outlines both, not just all the rights without any responsibilities.

  77. everyone knows you are just another Jewish sell out who is trying his damn hardest to show everyone how liberated and open minded he is while secretly harboring deep seated fear and hatred towards everyone.

  78. Now, if I am harboring this “deep-seated fear and hatred” secretly, then how come “everyone knows”?

  79. It’s reasonable for a specific white woman to be afraid of black men, if she has been attacked by him/them.  But it’s not reasonable for the government to build a public policy (“public”=for everyone) based on this specific white woman.

    What about a woman stabbed by a Russian immigrant?  What should we do based on that? Prohibit Russians from congregating?  Prevent Russians from building anything?

  80. It’s reasonable for a specific white woman to be afraid of black men, if she has been attacked by him/them.  But it’s not reasonable for the government to build a public policy (“public”=for everyone) based on this specific white woman.

    What about a woman stabbed by a Russian immigrant?  What should we do based on that? Prohibit Russians from congregating?  Prevent Russians from building anything?

  81. First of all, once again, let’s wait for CONVICTION, especially when leading evidence appears to be conversations.

    Secondly, nobody is denying that we have enemies or that there are people that hate us.  But there is no proof that these specific people building this specific islamic center have anything to do with your citation, is there?

  82. There are recognized exceptions to the free speech.  Any educated person knows that.
    Also, Fifth Amendment does nothing for you in the face of criminal EVIDENCE.  It only prevents government from forcing you to testify against yourself.  As an expert in Constitution, you ought to know that.  For shame!

  83.  Also, I see you are back with the steel mill.
    I will repeat this again: religious institution of any kind is NOT a commercial development.

    You can thank Christian fundamentalists for this law, adopted by a unanimous vote in 2000:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_Land_Use_and_Institutionalized_Persons_Act
    “Religious Land Use and Institutionalized Persons Act […] prohibits the imposition of burdens on the ability of prisoners to worship as they please, as well as giving churches and other religious institutions a way to avoid burdensome zoning law restrictions on their property use.”

     

  84. Marie- The Manhattan Beach Community Center sits right smack dab in the midle of apartments, and homes! They take up all of our parking before using their own lots-  some roll out of there drunk on party nights and hop in their cars and drive off home! There ya go- now you have an example of another place of “worship” that sits in between apartments and homes- Only the mosque that is going up on Voorhies will have NO DRINKING and very, very little auto traffic- mostly folks whom live in the area walking to it!

  85.  
    It is so sad the way geller and her drones are acting- like children on a school lot with nothing to do on their lunch break but gossip.
     Personally, I see no need for a Mosque right there- there is a new on by the police station and several others are all within walking distance- but- hey- I have 3 Jewish places of worship all within a stones throw- whatever works. You would think with all this wonderful “God/Allah/ Church” love floating around our nabe we would be so busy loving each other and caring for the infirm and elderly that there would be no time for this! If this is how people who love their God act- I guess I should become a Satanist.

  86. Remember also that there are those out there who protested that our Navy Seals killed an unarmed bin Laden.
    To which of course I would respond that he and his minions killed many many more unarmed US citizens and would do so again if we allow them.

  87. Everyone knows that that you are a Jewish sell out.
    But I personally know that your “Can’t we just get along” only a cover for some other shortcomings.

  88.  Obviously you missed the sarcasm in my sophism. I will try to get down to your thought level next time.

  89. I’m cool with that label, by the way.
    However, I’m interested in what kind of shortcomings could potentially be covered by the “Can’t we just get along” position.  Please explain (especially since you know me personally).

  90. But I also pledged my future attendance to the Chapel…  Granted, I’m rarely seen in a drunken stupor, but that’s easy to fix.

  91.  So you say, people should sit tight and wait and see if the mosque that might be coming up on their block harbors secret terrorist or not? Well, if you do mind them practicing first on your house and your children, then by all means let it be so. Other people do not want to put themselves in that position rightfully so, and they are trying to fight it within legal means available. No need to gang up on them (Bay People that is) they are just following liberties that constitution afforded to them. Due process is one of those, and if it takes that much to stop constructing a building with zoning violations, then due process allows them to go to court and challenge the construction. I do not even live in Sheepshead Bay, yet I donate to Bay People so that they can continue to exercise their right to due process.

  92. They are guilty by association. Living in the US and donating money to Taliban is in violation of the USA Patriot Act. Nuff said.

  93. 1. Yes, that is what I’m saying.  And I actually do live in Sheepshead Bay.

    2. Bay People have the right to due process just as mosque builders do. But, please read about the Religious Land Use and Institutionalized Persons Act:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_Land_Use_and_Institutionalized_Persons_Act
    Talk about the law of unintended consequences…

    Then, see:
    http://www.propublica.org/blog/item/experts-argue-all-you-want-mosque-project-on-firm-legal-ground

    So this litigation is likely to be a waste of time…

  94. You mean they got convicted of donating money to Taliban?  I think not yet, which was my point.

    However, based on your “guilt by association” legal principle, all immigrants from the
    former Soviet Union are guilty of being communists or, at least, providing material support to the Communist Party.

    Enough said, indeed.

  95. But that’s the point – no one here except Native Americans can submit a bigger claim than the other group.
    So Italians, Russians, Chinese or Pakistanis – all the same, as far as the United States of America is concerned.

  96. I need you to get off first, so I can have a seat. All religions have been guilty of heinous crimes against humanity, or more specifically twisted by those who create inhumane agendas in the name of religion.

  97. I’m all in favor of relabeling religious institutions as commercial developments, then we can fucking tax them and free up some fucking parking spots!

  98. Holly Near

    “I ain’t afraid of your Yahweh I ain’t afraid of your Allah I ain’t afraid of your Jesus I’m afraid of what you do in the name of your GodI ain’t afraid of your churches I ain’t afraid of your temples I ain’t afraid of your prayingI’m afraid of what you do in the name of your God”

  99. Please look at: http://www.investigativeproject.org/documents/case_docs/717.pdf
    GOVERNMENT
    EXHIBIT
    003-0078
    3:04-CR-240-G IS€-SW iW 0000412
    U.S. v. HLF, et
    First few pages – Arabic, after – English translation

    ” The activation of the role of (MAS) to educate the brothers in all work centers, mosques,and organizations on the necessity of stopping any contacts with the Zionist organizations and the rejection of any future contacts…”

    I am afraid to have MAS as a neighbor!!! Simply afraid!!!!!!!!!
    By the way, last year on their site they asked for donation, because of the $295,000.00  debt. At the same 2010 they had enough money to purchase the building on Staten Island, purchase land and build Mosque on Sheepshead Bay. Where did they get money from?

    Dear levp, you are a PRO in the google search. Can you please search and find out…
    Thank you

  100. You are so narrow minded it is pathetic. Why go into lengthly posts with your ignorance, just spew out a few expletives and go away. I do not share the enjoyment nor have the tolerance to toy with you as others.

  101. This fucking thread is like herpes, no matter what you do it is just not going away.

    Enough already, all you liberal hippies go smoke a doobie or drink a beer and love the one you with, and all you hate mongering tards don’t you have a cross to burn somewhere?

    Btw I don’t know about you but I will be watching out for them Arab looking folks tomorrow at Bay Fest. Who knows maybe they will do something unthinkable and evil like sell us some of that great food of theirs like gyros, shish kabab. You know what those fucking Arabs can do with an eggplant? It so good! You eat a little of that eggplant and next thing you know you are oozing precum and desperately looking for which way Mecca is.

    You come home and yell at your wife: “Halabala, halabala! Why you no cook like Arab woman, woman? Make me eggplant minus parmesan and bake me pita!”

    Wife: “Fuck you asshole! I’m not making you shit. You can go and buy that shawarma oven and shove it right up your ass with that eggplant of yours! What you think you are some Arab Sheikh to boss me around? First make enough money for an eggplant and then maybe I’ll cook it. Who the fuck do you think you are? With your salary you will be goat herder in Faisalabad and even there you are one poor schmuck. Next time I will go to Bay Fest too maybe some real man a Sheikh will fall in love and take me away from your broke ass.”

    You: “You think some fancy shamncy Sheikh will want your fat ass? And that mouth of yours? Whole army of Sheikhs will not know how to shut it.”

    Wife: “You short dick faggot! You going to talk about my fat ass? Did you know Joy from down the block couldn’t keep his eyes off my ass when I bend over to plant those flowers last Sunday!”

    You: “What??? Joy was looking at your ass! I will fucking kill that son of a bitch! Where is my bat? Where is my fucking bat? That scum bag motherfucker will be staring at my angel of a wife ass and he thinks he will get away with it? Not this time. No this fucking time buddy!

    And this this is why we should not let Arabs in to our neighborhood. If we will, we will kill each other.

  102. Why don’t you go and find yourself a camel to f**k? That is probably the only way you can feel anything anyway. Toy with the donkey, that might be more fitting (pun intended) for you.

  103. Since you made strange comment about white women/black men fear little earlier on, your problem is that you little friend is too little and you are really afraid of a black man stealing your little white wifey by throwing his huge bone to her. How is that for a shortcoming. Hypocrite.   

  104. do Orthodox Jews commit acts of terror on American soil. yeah, they breed like mice, but do they breed armies of potential future terrorists? 

  105. Were you relying on my words to make some kind of decision? That would be the only instance when it would be deceiving for you, my “a specious argument used for deceiving someone”.  Because you know, I can use Wiki as well, so I decided to use that word, instead of shpeel which is a more of an urban term, just to see if you would be so desperate to decode the meaning of every single word used, that you would google it. And you did. 
    How predictable 
    You are not autistic by any chance? That would explain your obsessive compulsive love affair with Wikipedia.

  106.  No, I am on the insane bus. You said you were getting off that one. Hurry up and go, I would like to take your seat now. 

  107. He can only find what is convenient for him, not the truth. I would not hold my breath for it. for him, not the truth. I would not hold my breath for it.

  108. levp, I am going to send you one proof about the MAS (developer of this Mosque) a day. Proof from my personal opinion. I’ll be happy if somebody can tell / proof me that all these materials are fakes and do not have any base… I’LL BE HAPPY! Seriously.

    Please look at: http://www.investigativeproject.org/documents/case_docs/717.pdf
    GOVERNMENT
    EXHIBIT
    003-0078
    3:04-CR-240-G IS€-SW iW 0000412
    U.S. v. HLF, et
    First few pages – Arabic, after – English translation


    The activation of the role of (MAS) to educate the brothers in all work
    centers, mosques,and organizations on the necessity of stopping any
    contacts with the Zionist organizations and the rejection of any future
    contacts…”

    I am afraid to have MAS as a neighbor!!! Simply afraid!!!!!!!!!
    By
    the way, last year on their site they asked for donation, because of
    the $295,000.00  debt. At the same 2010 they had enough money to
    purchase the building on Staten Island, purchase land and build Mosque
    on Sheepshead Bay. Where did they get money from?

    Dear levp, you are a PRO in the google search. Can you please search and find out…
    Thank you

  109.  you mean Russian were providing support to communist party while living in the US and enjoying all the liberties and probably benefits that US has to offer? hmmm, very doubtful that you can support your own “guilty by association” example.
    First of all, I do not remember communist party being on the State Department terror organizations list, do you have some info that no one else have? 

    Secondly, you seem to forget that Russian Jews came here to be free of communists, not to live here and support communist party with their earnings. Few people from a former USSR who were caught in recent years and deported under espionage charges were not even Jewish.  They were pure russians or non-Jews. Third of all, we were not talking about political parties here. We are talking about religion/faith whose followers are committing terror acts ALL AROUND THE GLOBE.there have been too MANY cases of imams with ties to radical islamic organizations, who are living and thriving in the US. you only picked russians, because there are a lot of russian jews commenting here. you could have picked chinese (commie country), germans (nazi ties) or sudan/bosnia/rwanda (genocide wars)

  110. Since you made strange comment about white women/black men fear little earlier on, your problem is that you little friend is too little and you are really afraid of a black man stealing your little white wifey by throwing his huge bone to her. How is that for a shortcoming. Hypocrite. 

  111. oh no, I am not hurt by your stupidity. just by the fact that you keep on turning everything that is being discussed here into a personal attack. did I call YOU narrow minded or ignorant? no I did not. perhaps it is you who needs growing up. 

  112. What a nice person to be so concerned about my health!
    Last time I checked, everything was OK (and I mean everything)…

    Wikipedia is just the most readily available resource.

  113. Wait a minute, your concern about my health and my family was not a personal attack?  Who is a hypocrite… 

  114. Yes, I could have picked any of those groups.  The argument is still the same – by using “guilt by association” as a legal principle, you would have to prosecute all Chinese, all Germans and all those other people, too.

    In fact, there are (or were) enough genuine Nazis living in the United States. One of them just got convicted in Germany:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Demjanjuk

    So, all Ukrainians are Nazi helpers, right?

  115. As I said before, it’s OK to be afraid of something, but it’s not OK to build a public policy based on that (such that affects other people).

    A different people are afraid of different things…

  116.  I do not see anything blanket about the statement that Orthodox Jews also breed like mice. But we are not talking about Jews here, are we? This whole “herpes” thread is about Islam, what it represents to the world at large and to the SB community around construction site in particular. Call them whatever they are, but they have legal rights and Bay People for one, are fighting the construction in the court of law. Whatever their means are, regardless of their motives – be it simple unwillingness to have place of worship on their block or fear of Islamic non-profit organization that will contribute nothing to their well being personally, but will create traffic problems and increased pollution, or their fears that property values will go down, or fear of the “sleeper cell” smack in the middle of their community, or  just plain and simple zoning violations already evident from the construction-whatever their motives are, they are entitled to a due process. And I for one, will support them even though I do not live in SB, for the simple solidarity and because this is one of the rare examples that I have encountered, where community is actually taking action against something and thus proving that here, in the US, citizens have legal means to fight what they do not believe is just. 

  117. Just the history… when Hitler came to the power, many Jewish people did want to move from the Germany. They did not believe… Result – HOLOCAUST.  What is the goal of the Radical Islam groups – “REAL” Jewish Holocaust…. This is it. And if radicals will get power, there will be no difference for them between ME (conservative and “against (HA)MAS”) and YOU (leftist and “pro – (HA)MAS”). We both are JEWS. Believe me, in Germany 1938 Hitler could find many Jews, who would kiss his ass in order to survive. But he killed almost everybody. I do not see the real difference between Hitler’s solving of the “Jewish problem” and HAMAS. The only difference, Hitler was stronger… But this is not a night yet. HA(MAS) has many supporters in order to gain the power… Too many, levp…

  118. Are you delusional or something? I have quite the contrary information from my family members who live in Israel. 

  119. he was sarcastic, cause Ms.Anderson tries to  stick unconstitutional label onto everything even remotely oppositional.

  120. As I said before, you absolutely have a right to due process.  Just keep in mind that everything you say (and write) could be used as evidence in the court of law.

    “Muslims breeding like mice” comment would look especially nice in judge’s eyes.

  121. I can only vouch for what I see on Google News.  You know the drill – please provide proof.

  122. So then he/she should have taken a lead from Sen. Kyl and add that “this was not intended to be a factual statement”…

  123.  Your IQ is too high for this site. 90% of people will not understand you till its too late.

  124. We are not talking about nationality or political parties here, you seem to forget.
    We are talking about one of 4 or 5 dominant faiths in the world, which is the only faith that in modern times allows and praises killings of “infidels”. 

    Perhaps people who are behind this mosque really have nothing to do with terrorists, but what if they do? Do you want to find out the hard way or should you nip it in the bud? with ties to MAS, it is very hard to ignore the fact that money that were obtained for construction are of a shady origin, and where money are shady, most of the time the people behind this money trail are shady as well. 

  125. keep on defending Constitution until one day it stops defending you, because American Constitution means nothing to Islam. They would probably burn Declaration of Independence if they had a chance. Just sayin’.

  126. In reply to me, quote:

    “our problem is that you little friend is too little and you are really afraid of a black man stealing your little white wifey by throwing his huge bone to her”

    And, in reply to a different poster:

    “Why don’t you go and find yourself a camel to f**k? That is probably the only way you can feel anything anyway. Toy with the donkey, that might be more fitting (pun intended) for you”

    Posted by the same RY/GoodFella/Rufina/Guest.

    So I ask again, who is pathetic here?

  127. Did you hear a threat about rat poison? Until there is a threat from me to those Muslims who breed like mice, I am just exercising my rights to a free speech, don’t you agree? I know Lisanne would support my argument wholeheartedly, won’t you Lisanne? 

  128. In addition to the right to due process, you also have a right to free speech.  By all means, continue exercising it.

    My point is, however, that you are bolstering Mr. Deek’s “race card” arguments (see the article).

  129.  Cool! We’ll switch! Ignorance is often bliss!

    In case you don’t understand my point, I’m against the mosque being where it is due to the issue of parking, traffic (pedestrian & vehicular) and location, since I believe it’d be better served being on a main road with more than just one lane for each direction, but any valid complaints are buried by the hatred of the more ignorant supporters against the mosque.

  130. You know what, seriously, continue relying on Google News and Wikipedia. There are no other sources of information out there. None. Unless of course you are listening to Al-Jazeera, which I know you do not as you do not understand Arabic.Do you need a moment to Google what Al-Jazeera is? Take your time.  

  131. Did I say that your comment was narrow minded or stupid or ignorant? you brought up the subject of white women/black men, not me. 

  132. I know what Al-Jazeera is, but my link was not from them – if would bother clicking on it, you would see that it is Detroit Free Press. 

  133. You really should improve your reading skills:
    http://bklyner.com/2011/05/sheepshead-bay-mosque-wins-first-court-battle/#comment-203132236

    comment by Courvasier2004, quote:

    “PS. It is normal for people to hate others that done harm to them. If you are a white woman who was gang raped by blacks you would be afraid of the blacks. Actions done by small group would cause her to be afraid of the whole group. If she would walk in a dark alley and would see a group of blocks they would be viewed as a threat.”

    Courvasier2004 != levp

    Seriously, I have to point this out?

  134. You sure can that all the priests are pedophiles and pederasts.  However, no parent is forced to send their kids to the Catholic schools/churches/confessions where they would be exposed to those unscrupulous men who pretend they are holy. However these folks can not avoid the mosque being built in their community if this goes through. And there is nothing holy about Quran allowing followers of this faith to carry out acts of violence against those who are of a different faiths and/or atheists. Islamic clerics have interpreted Quran in such terms that it became mandatory to harm those who are of different faiths or no faith at all. 

  135. No one is forcing you to ether live near or even pass by this site.  If you don’t like your new neighbors, you can’t force them to move – but you can move yourself.

  136. So you are OK with all the expletives used here, not to mention that this rant does not make any sense no matter what side you are on? I think I should take back the statement where I said that I did not have any comments regarding your intelligence or something to that extent. That must have been another levp, not you. 

  137. you must be joking? people living there for all their lives have to suddenly move so that mosque can be built without any opposition? why? are there not enough empty buildings on Coney Island avenue to serve as a mosque? I can name quite few that were even not finished but they look like they were intended for that purpose solely. I do not understand why it has to be right in the middle of quiet residential block no matter how much rights they have to practice their religion?  

  138. It doesn’t matter whether it’s a mosque or a synagogue or just a family that you don’t like.
    It doesn’t matter if there are 10 empty houses nearby.
    It is their right under current laws, and that’s that. 

  139. If I can not hold logical conversation, why you keep on replying to me? are you keeping an illogical conversation since I can not keep logical one? 

  140. It makes me feel good.  Not quite as good as some other activities do, but the day is long.  Now back to my doobie.(*)

    (*)This is not intended to be a factual statement…

  141. I did not see that one. My bad, I take anything that pertains to this sub thread  back. I did not realize you were just responding to Courvasier2004. 
    But what do you mean by “Courvasier2004 != levp”?
    Does it mean Courvasier2004 is levp or Courvasier2004 is NOT levp?

  142. ok, then. i am against it as well where it is. but I also dislike what Islam represents and how much pain Islam followers inflicted around the world. But I will stick to the zoning and money trail stuff.

  143. I did not bother to check. I was not interested in bin – Laden link. He has not been a major player for many years and now instead of him dying quietly he is a martyr which plays into Islamic radicals hands. Now they have an excuse to start a next “Reign of Terror”. You know the drill – Google it.

  144. Not his article – Ned’s article above.  In fact, it’s a quote from Bay People’s article: 
    “Deek, the defense attorney, had only one argument, the “race card””.

  145.  its about the WRONG PLACE.

    Its legal to build a cemetery next to you.

    BUT, would you want the cemetery next door to you?

  146.  Stop bothering levp.

    Some people are retarded, but they deserve the same RIGHTS as everyone else.

    Levp is correctly praying for ALLAH and 73 virgins. Levp will respond after the 5th pray of the day

  147. Al-Jazeera now has the English version. Hillary Clinton and Barak Obama introduced that to us and said this is the great thing. levp, please search on google if i am correct.  But russian news nobody introduced… I am sorry, free market did.

  148. Lisanne, unfortunately things today are non-constitutional. Most important – BIG GOVERNMENT, which George Bush and Barak Obama successfully  created and more than half of the people in our country on the Government Assistance. If you do not want to work – no problems = welfare, medicaid, food stamps…. Millions of the poor uneducated immigrants right to the walfare in order to make more votes for democrats…

  149. Anytime a Religious institution wants to open on a residential block, you have debate.  People who reside next to the site, don’t want it. People live blocks away, don’t mind it.

    Who in the RIGHT mind parking get worse on the block?

  150. Guest, do you like scary movies? I like scary movies. Do you want to come over and watch Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Bomb?
    After the movie we can both go down to Columbia and enter in to Columbia Schzophrenia Research Program. So what you say buddy?

  151.  Actually, that’s your business anyway.

    240 comments on this thread. And it’s getting so far away from the substance of the article that perhaps its not worth making a reply anymore.

  152.  Today, Manhattan. Meeting “Third Intifada”, “Free Palestine from the river to the sea” .
    My understanding – that is mean kill the Israel and drop all the Israeli’s Jews into the sea. Please correct if I am wring?
    http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com/atlas_shrugs/2011/05/muslims-march-in-jewish-genocide-bund-rally-in-new-york-city.html
    I know Pamela is a very controversial person, but the photos are probably real. Just google the event… The lawyer of the Bay People opponents are there…

  153. That’s it. The bad will come to you on Tuesday. Remember this. You
    called me a camel fucker you piece of camel shit.

  154. Too funny. Lev can I have a loan on my good word. No, wait I am looking for an apartment in a nice neighborhood that is well kept. I also would like someone with a great education a sense of responsible morals to be my Rabbi (with all due respect). I think with all that we can avoid public assistance, not that it is a bad thing for those who are truly struggling. Any takers Lev? 😉 

  155. You are so right, I was responding to my e-mails before I saw the mootness*.LOL
    *My own new word, When a moot person displays the actions of moot

  156. I am too lazy to read everything, human nature is to hate people that are different. Some people, myself included, do get over stigmas society or life has bestowed on them only to become stronger.That one bad apple syndrome (black doing a white wrong) is what has to go.

  157. Wait, George Bush created a program that makes more votes for Democrats?
    He is even less smart than I thought… 

  158.  Don’t worry, this one will be around to amuse us for quite some time. Even when they start repeating themselves they just can’t shut up.

  159. George Bush is the worst president in US history!!! My personal opinion.
    1. He is a BIG GOVERNMENT PROGRESSIVE REPUBLICAN (meaning talking like republican and promote AMERICAN free market values, but doing everything as a radical left democrat, as far as expending Government)
    2. Actually, as far as I can see, he and his boss were worry about the Halliburton first. Everything else – secondary
    3. Only the evil-president like George Bush could create an atmosphere in the country, in which people votes for “Hope and Change” (read Barak Obama).
    And see what we have now…. growing unemployment ( real, not statistic), the war with the “Rich” ( remember Russia 1917 ) and…. Bay People against the Mosque throughout the country… “Blame Bush”….. – make perfect sense. He created Obama / Akselrod / Hillary Clinton administration…

  160. Lisanne, you are totally wrong. The last what we want is to abuse people like You. Absolutely seriously. We want our voice to be heard! So far, politicians do not hear us, because they created an atmosphere where the people on food stamps more then people with pay check… What do we have to do – just to educate people like you are ( nice people with the open hard to help all the people to much, so emotions will prevail and the simple math and common sense – less and less). So you can finally get the statistic / census and start to analyze why millions people are moving from the Blue States (like Michigan ) to the Red states ( like Texas and South Carolina)… We do not have any other choices. The only internet so far. But do not worry, they will 100%  control an internet very son… :-((
    And most important – who created the atmosphere “Bay People against Mosque” throughout the country and why they did it. Just start to think and analyze. This is it. You are an intelligent person…

  161. You must be new here.  We are all used to Faba – if you don’t like him, you don’t have to read this blog. 

  162. Fava is busy praying for Allah and 72 virgins. He is watching porn of Osama and just tool two Osama Viagra pills.
    Fava’s brain cells are not working well after all the drugs over doses.

  163. Since when people overdose from only doubling prescribed amount? Also a question, am I watching Osama’s porn collection or a video of Osama watching Osama’s porn collection? It makes big difference you know. Oh one more thing, praying for 72 virgins doesn’t work. I have been praying to every deity I can think of since I was 13, still can’t get a break. However Creigslist romance section works all the time! Well sometimes 22 year old blond looking for sugar daddy turn out to be overweight truck drivers from Bayonne but who am I to complain, it’s still works better than praying for virgins.
    So maybe we should start praying to Craigslist?
    Oh and yet another thing, it’s “Faba” , fava is what Hannibal Lecter had with liver and nice Chianti.

    Thank you.

  164. Looks like Lisanne has nothing to say to my comment from last week.

    While like Lisanne I support the constitution and freedom that it gives us.  Unlike Lisanne I distinguish between those that need those and and those that dont.  As an atheist I dont support any religion.  My personal opinion is that Islam is the worst religion in the world.  While different religions were responsible for bad things throughout time, Islam is the only one that current supports and encourages acts that the rest of the world would view as barbaric.  Why would you give someone equal rights when that person wants to destroy your way of life.

    Immigration should be judged the same way.  I support those that want to come here to make something out of their life.  Those who want to come here to blow themselves up to seek Allah can do it intheir homeland.

     

  165. How am I narrow minded? I was making a point to Lisanne who claims there are no zoning violations.  Those of us who lost friends / family in 9/11 see Muslims in a different light after what a small group of radicals did.  Whenever a small group does something bad it will bring bad light to the group as a whole. 

  166. How am I narrow minded? I was making a point to Lisanne who claims there are no zoning violations.  Those of us who lost friends / family in 9/11 see Muslims in a different light after what a small group of radicals did.  Whenever a small group does something bad it will bring bad light to the group as a whole. 

  167. I’ll let Lev enlighten you as to ho3 practically every religion can be viewed as “barbaric” and dangerous even through the mere exercise of reading their sacred texts. We won’t even begin to discuss how religion has been used to justify wars of conquest. But if I was a Hawaiian in the latter part of the 19th century I would have come to the conclusion that Christians are dangerous murderers. Even in the continental United States the bearers of religion were followed by the army. All done in the name of “manifest destiny”, which had all the passion of religious fervor. Can’t ban the Christians, for the majority of Americans were Christians at the time of the founding of this country. Nevertheless, the framers of the constitution knew well how religionists seek power in the name of their group, and once having done so, will oppress those belonging to other groups. So they decided to protect everyone, all beliefs are equal under the law. So say what you about “Muslim terrorists”, it changes nothing. Muslims are free to worship their religion. They are also obligated to live by our laws. We penalize those who break our laws. But we do not take away their right to worship even when under the law we take away their right to freedom of movement through imprisonment.

  168. “Whenever a small group does something bad it will bring bad light to the group as a whole.” 

    Um, remember Max Gelman?

  169. I have literally posted no more than 5 comments regarding the mosque and it really doesn’t effect me because i don’t live anywhere near that location. Question that i do have out of curiosity is for the people on here that keep saying this is America and its their right to build it because the law says they can. So how do you feel about the 2nd amendment right to bear arms?   

  170. We want, Muslim people want.  Politicians and radical extremists don’t. This is their job to put people against each other and get the dividends out of that. That what MAS is doing with the support of our politicians. They easy calculated the reaction of the Jewish people in this area on their insertion (MAS, according the ADL and many other sources – Jew-hatred organization) and telling the regular Muslim people – You see who they are? They hate us and they are racists… So, let’s get along… 🙁 Tell that to the MAS leaders in front of our politicians…

  171. If you mean me, I’m fine with it.  However, I do think that some weapons should not fall under the protection of the Second Amendment.
    For example, you can have your rifle or a revolver, or even a collection of both. Plus swords and knives, if you feel like it. But a fully-automatic machine gun – a bit too much.
    Is that a good compromise?

  172. I’ll take that semi-auto over nothing any day of the week however I also believe I have a right to own semi auto AR-15 If I want to. The way law set  up today in NY even if AR-15 is semi-auto it still considered assault weapon and that is just not fare. Gun rights is one of my favorite topics and personally I think NYC does disservice to it’s citizens by having pretty much complete ban on weapons in the city.

  173. You see, the problem is that weapons sellers have to distinguish between you and those who already participated in the Columbia Schizophrenia Research study.
    I don’t trust them with this task.

  174. Despite recent Supreme Court decisions, the Second Amendment contains a comma, not a semi-colon.

    “A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.”

    That said, it only means that the constitution does not directly give citizens the right to bear arms, except as it provides a means towards protection of the State.

    In this day we do not expect armed citizens to come to the aid of the state. Thusly, the import of this clause is lost. 

    We hold legal traditions dear in this country. So when functional purpose is lost, an attempt is made to rework an outdated framework so as to continue its usefulness. Thusly it becomes argued that the comma acts in the same manner as the semi-colon. The word “being” joins the two halves into one. The first half provides the reasoning for the second half.

    So does this nullification give the states the right to pass legislation that control the ownership of guns? Yes. Can states ban guns totally. No. 

    Despite the reasoning, the right for citizens to bear arms was given in perpetuity. It was a agreement made between the State and its Citizens. That militias would not form spontaneously at a future time was not a consideration in its wording. Thusly, the right remains, though limitations are not disallowed. The current Supreme Court agrees with that in principle. But they have done in a manner that is not definitive enough to avoid confusion. Thusly, in the future the court will be asked for clarification regarding the legality of various laws, some of which have been on the books for a considerable period of time.

  175. You’re being clever with words. Faba hasn’t participated in the Columbia Schizophrenia Research study, yet!

    We do not know what the future will bring.

  176. I’ve been around politicians, political theorists, activists and others who have given thought that what might be right and what might be wrong about our society for at least 40 years now. And I learned one thing that I consider to be of primary importance, because it defines the reason that groups of Americans attack other groups of Americans. The simple fact is that most Americans don’t recognize who the real enemy is. The real enemy is not the Muslim. It’s not the African American who is perceived to be receiving constant aid from the government. We could go on, but the point is made. No, the real enemy are those who have taken this country from its position of having one of the highest standards of living to one where the majority of its citizens have less than one third of all of the assets while the richest 1% control the other two thirds. Is this a meaningless disparity? Not at all.  And its meaning will become clear when the next crash happens, and it can occur in a number of ways. The house of cards that the 1% have built is a precarious one. But when it collapses they will survive. But the lower 99%? Well, move to your Red state, and as many of your fellow Red staters will remain clueless it shall be up to us Blue Staters to pick up the pieces. The very same scenario which was the aftereffect of the Crash of ’29. But the Crash of ’29 is going to look like a rehearsal, the coming fall is going to be devastating.receiving constant aid from the government. We could go on, but the point is made. No, the real enemy are those who have taken this country from its position of having one of the highest standards of living to one where the majority of its citizens have less than one third of all of the assets while the richest 1% control the other two thirds. Is this a meaningless disparity? Not at all.  And its meaning will become clear when the next crash happens, and it can occur in a number of ways. The house of cards that the 1% have built is a precarious one. But when it collapses they will survive. But the lower 99%? Well, move to your Red state, and as many of your fellow Red staters will remain clueless it shall be up to us Blue Staters to pick up the pieces. The very same scenario which was the aftereffect of the Crash of ’29. But the Crash of ’29 is going to look like a rehearsal, the coming fall is going to be devastating.

  177.  Haha It is true, I might be one small step and a hop away from becoming permanent member of Columbia reaserch facility but until then I really want to protect myself when angry mob of pro-Arab, anti-Arab, angry Jews, angry Christians, angry minorities and angry white people show up at my door to give me a beating of my life 🙂

  178. I wasn’t pointing fingers at anyone specific. I was just interested in seeing if the same people here that are pro 1st are pro 2nd. As for full auto i don’t think it is necessary in everyday life. The problem i have is its a long drawn out process and an expensive one in NYC to get a handgun permit. It could cost around $500 and take up to a year and you still might be denied. Also besides the process there are so many restrictions on what type of gun you can buy its absurd. Do people need fully auto sub machine guns with 30 round mags no not really that wouldn’t help with zombies anyway. At the same time i wouldn’t be able to buy a Rifle with a pistol grip and a 10 round mag that is single shot. Even with the restrictions on what you can buy there are plenty of guns that are legal that are more than sufficient to protect yourself. Again the problem is how hard they make the process for an average joe to get a permit and that’s just for the home. It is almost impossible to get a carry permit in this city which is where the biggest problem is.

  179.  I am not a lawyer and am not going to try and interpret the law. It sounds like you are and i did not know that. Either way 45 of 50 say its ok for citezens to walk into a store and buy any gun they want after all the proper paperwork is done. It doesn’t take a year and it doesn’t say what you can and cant buy. It also doesn’t cost $500 maybe at the most $50. Politicians are public servants they have armed guards and most carry guns as well. A police officer carries a gun during work hours because that’s what they do why are they allowed to carry guns when off duty. I am not some loony redneck that wants an arsenal for the apocalypse. I am just a tax paying American that wants to exercise his constitutional right like anyone else. Also see my reply to Levp.

  180. I wrote the above from a totally legal point of view. I studied law years ago, but the second amendment considerations are still the same, even after the Supreme Court clarifications. 

    My personal concern about guns is that if someone wants to use it for protection they had best first be trained in its use. Second, people have to be psychologically prepared for the possibility that they might actually use the gun. Killing someone is not something most people can do without pause. But since you most likely to be actually firing the gun as a last resort you have to act quickly.

    I knew someone who killed a would-be rapist with a knife. She was never the same afterwards. Nevertheless, survival is imperative. But before carrying any weapons it is wise to consider the implications of doing so. If you’re sure of yourself, then I don’t have a problem.

    We do need to have guns registered. Just the same as we register cars. But as we know, those who wish firearms for illegal purposes will get them, laws or no laws. That hole does need to be permanently closed. 

  181. I agree with you that people should be trained and practice all the time. I didnt look it up but would think that less than 1% of legal gun owners have actually killed someone in self defense. You hope that you never have to use it but if a Max Gelman is coming at me with a knife i would not hesitate to kill him. How many times do you hear or read about a self defense shooting in the city? Maybe just a couple a year. How often do you hear about drug dealers or robbers using guns? All the time. I would rather have a gun on me all the time and be safe than sorry and hope i never even have to pull it out. Unfortunately in NYC its virtually impossible to get a carry permit and i dont intend on possessing a gun illegally so i will have to trust my BGBGS (bad guy be good stick).

  182.  If you are sure of that then a gun would be useful. When I was younger I carried a long knife, hidden in the lining of high boots I wore. I got pinned by a cop once, she asked me why I was wearing high boots in June. We both knew the answer, but I wasn’t about to admit it. Luckily I never needed to use it, but I did know how to pull it out quick. I did have some uncertainty as o whether I’d pause. But it had a handle that I could keep a firm grip on.

    Even spike maces are illegal. I knew someone who carried one. It was over 200 years old, and would probably split if he had used it. But he walked around some of our more colorful neighborhoods carrying it. A cop once told him he was nuts to do it, but let him go on his way.

  183. A person that would walk around with a mace should not be allowed to own a gun. Was he wearing armor?

  184. A person that would walk around with a mace should not be allowed to own a gun. Was he wearing armor?

  185. He would have if he could. He was to be as outrageous as possible. Luckily he decided that it was a nuisance he didn’t want to deal with.

    Interestingly he never showed much of an interest in weapons otherwise.

  186. I’m sure we could come to a mutually-satisfying compromise. 1 day waiting period – not enough. 1 year waiting period – way too much. I don’t care for the pistol grip.
    10 rd magazine should be enough.

    Very bad things tend to happen when the above is not the case.  Here are a few thoughts with examples:

    1. People who might mistake Jehovah’s Witnesses at their door
    (or cops, or fellow students)
    for zombies should have their access to guns restricted.  (I’m talking Virginia Tech here.)  A “seriously disturbed” guy easily buying even a small-capacity gun = bad for your children.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virginia_Tech_massacre
    Used Glock 19 (cap. 15) and Walter P22 (cap. 10), bought legally

    http://www.roanoke.com/multimedia/vtshootingmap/interactive.html
    Dead: 32, wounded: ?

    2. People who might decide to follow Sharron Angle’s advice and pursue “Second Amendment remedies” against government as a whole or specific politicians that these people may not like.
    http://voices.washingtonpost.com/plum-line/2010/06/sharron_angle_floated_possibil.html
    What to do with them?

    Of course, the most recent example is in Tucson, AZ:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jared_Lee_Loughner
    Used Glock 19 semiautomatic (cap. 33), bought legally  
    Dead: 6 (incl. a 9 year old girl), wounded: 13
    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2011/01/09/AR2011010901912.html
    “The 22-year-old passed an instant background check required under federal law for all gun buyers, said Reese Widmer, manager of the Tucson store. A law enacted last year allowed Loughner to conceal and carry the pistol without a permit.”

    Argument that “he could have bought 10 small-cap. guns instead” doesn’t work, as he then could have bought 10 hi-cap. guns just as well, and kill half the town in 1 (long) minute.
    http://www.rochestercitynewspaper.com/news/blog/2011/01/The-Tucson-shooting-more-bullets-can-mean-more-harm/
    “Glock 19 that alleged shooter Jared Loughner is said to have used against Giffords is legal in New York, but the 30-plus-round magazine he allegedly used is not.”

    3. Related to number 2, “sovereign citizens”…
    http://www.splcenter.org/blog/2010/11/01/sovereign-citizen-movement-growing-new-splc-video-promotes-law-enforcement-safety/
    “…two West Memphis, Ark., police officers met a father-son team of sovereigns, Jerry and Joe Kane, during a routine late-morning traffic stop. As officers Brandon Paudert and Bill Evans puzzled over the incomprehensible paperwork presented by father Jerry, son Joe, 16, emerged from the vehicle with his AK-47 blazing and fatally shot both officers. The Kanes fled, but were tracked and killed in a shootout with police an hour later in a Wal-Mart parking lot after wounding two more officers.”
    Check out the training video, produced by SPLC and narrated by the father of one of those cops:

    (includes footage from their dash cam)

    In conclusion:
    – mandatory safety education;
    – background check (including psych);
    – some reasonable waiting period (how about 3 days?);
    – magazine capacity restrictions (10 rd?).

    That’s all I want from “gun control”.

  187. That’s how it started. We found it in an antique store. We thought it looked cool, so he bought it. The cost alone should have been a prohibition against carrying it around. But some people get very strange ideas.

  188.  I know of the shootings you referenced but i didn’t read any of the links you provided. I read an article that compares shootings like this to same type of shootings but with armed people. It showed that when someone is armed a fraction of the amount of people are killed or injured because they can defend themselves. There are crazy people everywhere and just because those crazies bought legit guns doesn’t mean anything. They could have bought guns illegally and did the same thing. All it proves is that people kill not guns just like stupid drivers. Drug and robbery related killings happen everyday and it has nothing to with 30 round mags. Do we need mags like that for self defense in a handgun probably not. the only place i would like a mag like that is at a shooting range so i wouldn’t have to reload as much. I dont mind background checks or a reasonable waiting period. I think 10-12 rounds for self defense should be enough. At the same time i dont own a gun and have never been in a gun fight so i dont know and most people that own guns dont know either. We can go back and forth on this subject for a very long time and it wont get us anywhere. I was just curious about how people felt about our rights or just picking and choosing what they think is right.    

  189. Except psych. It makes no difference. You can buy a gun get all the tests you need 2 days later lose your job find your wife cheating and go nuts. Again we can go back and forth but its pointless. We are not far off.

  190. hell no, LOL

    got a hand sized pocket knife for that….. it’s Legal 🙂

    Hope i never need it.

  191. hell no, LOL

    got a hand sized pocket knife for that….. it’s Legal 🙂

    Hope i never need it.

  192. The guy loses his job, goes nuts and kills people he doesn’t like – straight from your comment.

  193. As Pat Paulsen once said “Guns aren’t the problem, it’s bullets. Let people have all the guns they want, just lock up the bullets. Hunters always say it’s the thrill of the hunt. Imagine the thrill of sneaking up on a 400 pound grizzly with an unloaded rifle”.

  194. Exactly. Now im thinking do i want to go through the hassle of applying for a gun permit in nyc.

  195. Ned. 303 comments so far.. Did you have so many comments before? The only explanation is – people are worry… 
    levp, you like to refer to wikipedia all the time. See
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muslim_American_Society
    The Muslim American Society (MAS) is a nonprofit organization founded in 1993 that describes itself as an Islamic revival and reform movement.
    It was created after a debate among Muslim Brotherhood members in the U.S. about whether to remain underground or to have a public face. Both Mohammed Mahdi Akef, now the Egyptian Muslim Brotherhood
    Supreme Guide, and Ahmed Elkadi, then the leader of the U.S. Muslim
    Brotherhood, were pivotal in the founding of the MAS. The new
    organization instructed its members to evade questions about the group’s
    ties to the Muslim Brotherhood, and to define jihad as a “divine legal right” of Muslims to be used for defense and the spread of Islam. MAS leaders have said that these views are not now held by MAS leaders.[1]
    MAS also has an affiliate, the MAS Freedom Foundation,[2] whose Executive Director is Mahdi Bray.

  196. No, this merely shows that a small number of people are putting up a large number of comments on a thread. These statistics are available to web administrators.

  197. Lisanne, did you read the article from Wikipedia above? If yes, can you please comment. I know levp always refer to the Wikipedia, court documents, testimonials? Please, Lisanne. I am really serious.  Let’s have a dialog, 2 way street,. Not just Bay people show their concern, you call them racists and the end of the story. Lisanne, maybe we can make a townhall meeting and talk all together. Intelligently. Maybe we can ask Ned to organize it through the web-site. let’s bring MAS leaders, Bay people, Police (to make sure no emotions and no problems), politicians, everybody and talk. Together. What do you think?

  198. Pisan! Stop spinning random info to your own advantage. 303 comments does not mean people are worry. 303 comments means people are talking, and some of them are talking about dumbass things (some posted by me but many by others) that are in this thread.
    In no way, shape or form 303 comments mean people are flipping out. You are twisting the truth like Glenn Beck and O’reilly does. Yes this thread has 303 posts, how does that transfer to people worrying about the Mosque? Maybe I can spin it other way, their are so many posts in this thread because all people on Sheepshead Bay are worried about racism and religious intolerance that is growing in our community?
    Personally however I would like to think they are all here to enjoy my dick jokes. But lets be honest none of those 3 scenarios are true.

  199. Ok, Faba, Lisanne, levp. You won. Nobody want to argue on issues, nobody want to talk about details and read the documents. It’s easier do not see anything…
    Me personally – I try to speak for all of you, even you do not want that (do not understand or do not want to understand). Just look at, when all these local fights started? Serious fights. Beginning of 2009… Why? Just think. I lost, but unfortunately, you did not win. You also lost… We are doomed… The socialist propaganda works.

    “Nazi first came for the Communists, and I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a Communist.
    Then they came for the Jews, and I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a Jew.

    Then they came for the trade unionists, and I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a trade unionist.

    Then they came for the Catholics, and I didn’t speak up because I was a Protestant.

    Then they came for me – and by that time no one was left to speak up”

    – Pastor Martin Niemöller

  200.  Sheepshead Bay Mosque Attorney Lamis Deek Calls for End of Israel AGAINMonday, May 16, 2011 11:44 PMFrom: “Bay People Inc.” View contact detailsTo: undisclosed-recipients
    Dear neighbors, residents, and Bay People supporters,
    On Sunday March 15, 2011 some NYC Muslims marched in what is known “Third Intifada Rally” calling for an annihilation of the state of Israel. Just five days after standing in Kings Country Supreme Court (May 10) and accusing Sheepshead Bay residents of being racists for defending their rights to quiet enjoyment of their properties, Lamis Deek made this hateful speech calling for annihilation of Israel.
    Please click on this You Tube Video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1KdXXbTLiOo&feature=player_embedded that was taken by one of our community members.
    Sheepshead Bay is home to a great number of Holocaust survivors and descendants of Holocaust survivors and we do NOT tolerate hate and violence in our community. Is this what Voorhies Mosque proponent Allowey Ahmed calls “being a good neighbor?” Are these the kinds of speeches that will be broadcast from Voorhies Avenue Mosque?
    We are appealing Judge’s Portnow’s denial of preliminary injunction and are actively working on the Zoning Challenge within the Department of Buildings. It is extremely disappointing that our elected Judges and City Officials continue to overlook blatant violations of building codes, zoning regulations and a number of unpaid fines. Instead of protecting residents from inappropriate development, our elected officials are turning their backs on those that helped elect them in the first place. Please write, call and e-mail our elected officials and let them know how you feel! Visit our website http://www.BayPeople.org for a full list of names and addresses.
    Sincerely, Bay People Inc.info@baypeople.org or 646-673-6297 Bay People Inc. was created by Sheepshead Bay neighborhood residents.  We are not affiliated with any political party and our activists do not share common religion, race or heritage.  We voluntarily dedicate hours of our time to help preserve our residential Sheepshead Bay community and cover most expenses ourselves. We welcome every resident who wants to participate, and look forward to hearing from you.

  201. Dear guywhocare, our liberal friends do not watch these kind of video and do not read documents. They do not want to hear us. Just gave us the “racist” label and the end of the story… They are brain washed by Saudi Arabia supported propaganda (check the price on the gas station) and think the dream of Israeli evil- soldiers only killing HA(MAS) kids. The multibillion oil based propaganda 🙁 And their leaders tech them how to react, if somebody try to explain them something. How many times I asked them to sit down and create an intelligent fact-based conversation… They refused – not their tactic… Read Sol Alinsky “Rules for radicals”

  202. I did see it. MAS celebrates the victory. They know how to use the American system, political correctness and professional career politicians in order to get what they want. They even do not hide… Even Wikipedia is telling that ”
    It was created after a debate among Muslim Brotherhood members in the U.S. about whether to remain underground or to have a public face. Both Mohammed
    Mahdi Akef, now the Egyptian Muslim Brotherhood
    Supreme Guide, and Ahmed Elkadi, then the leader of the U.S. Muslim
    Brotherhood, were pivotal in the founding of the MAS. The new
    organization instructed its members to evade questions about the group’s
    ties to the Muslim Brotherhood, and to define jihad as a “divine legal right” of Muslims to be used for defense and the spread of Islam. MAS leaders have said that these views are not now held by MAS leaders.[1]

    MAS also has an affiliate, the MAS Freedom Foundation,[2] whose Executive Director is Mahdi Bray.”
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muslim_American_Society

  203. people just keep filing unsafe working conditions with osha, they will fine and shut down the project for one week with every complaint. 

  204.  
    Sheepshead Bay Mosque Attorney Lamis Deek Calls for End of Israel AGAINMonday, May 16, 2011 11:44 PMFrom: “Bay People IncDear neighbors, residents, and Bay People supporters,On Sunday March 15, 2011 some NYC Muslims marched in what is known “Third Intifada Rally” calling for an annihilation of the state of Israel. Just five days after standing in Kings Country Supreme Court (May 10) and accusing Sheepshead Bay residents of being racists for defending their rights to quiet enjoyment of their properties, Lamis Deek made this hateful speech calling for annihilation of Israel.Please click on this You Tube Video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v… that was taken by one of our community members. Sheepshead Bay is home to a great number of Holocaust survivors and descendants of Holocaust survivors and we do NOT tolerate hate and violence in our community. Is this what Voorhies Mosque proponent Allowey Ahmed calls “being a good neighbor?” Are these the kinds of speeches that will be broadcast from Voorhies Avenue Mosque?We are appealing Judge’s Portnow’s denial of preliminary injunction and are actively working on the Zoning Challenge within the Department of Buildings. It is extremely disappointing that our elected Judges and City Officials continue to overlook blatant violations of building codes, zoning regulations and a number of unpaid fines. Instead of protecting residents from inappropriate development, our elected officials are turning their backs on those that helped elect them in the first place. Please write, call and e-mail our elected officials and let them know how you feel! Visit our website http://www.BayPeople.org for a full list of names and addresses.,  

  205. “First Nazi came for the Communists, and I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a Communist.

    Then they came for the Jews, and I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a Jew.

    Then they came for the trade unionists, and I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a trade unionist.

    Then they came for the Catholics, and I didn’t speak up because I was a Protestant.

    Then they came for me – and by that time no one was left to speak up”

    – Pastor Martin Niemöller

  206. Did you see the article in Bay news by Thomas Tracy. FBI meet with young Muslims.FBI agent gives a group of Muslim teens a lesson in military hardware,shoulder missile launcher, one of several weapons on display during the FBI Muslim Youth Conference. ( Kingsborough College) That what they teach those kids ?? Building bridges with BOMBS. God help us.

  207. No, i did not see. Just looked at video you send below… Scare… No words. next Jewish Holocaust? Starting with the Fogel’s family? I even afraid to think? Theater of Absurd. HAMAS is the Government of Palestine, HAMAS – is a terrorist organization as per US Government http://www.nctc.gov/site/groups/hamas.html
    and in the MIddle of NYC this kind of meeting “Free Palestine”. From whom? From Jews. of course. I even do not talk about the history of this land … Nobody from the left want to hear that. By the way, leader of MAS also supports HAMAS as per well known video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bBIcfigtbEU

  208. I am an American of arab/muslim decent and have being an atheist all my life. I do feel sorry for the residents of the neighborhoods who will suffer from increase foot and car traffic. However, this is NYC and it is the mostly densely populated major city in the US if not the world. The last time i checked, the population density in NYC is 25,000 per square mile. So based on thier argument, muslims would not be able to build a mosque anywhere in NYC.
    I think once geller, spencer and the tea party fanatics got involved in this, the issue stopped being a zoning issue and became about issues much bigger than than that. The US constitution and the founding principles of this country became at stakes. If the mosque builders were to give in to the community’s wishes and stop building the mosque, geller and the other loones will view that as a victory for them and that is hard to do.

    peace out.

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